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Post by randy on Oct 12, 2018 20:32:28 GMT -6
Does anybody know if there is still some semen on any of John Wayne's bulls? There were some really good cattle at 26 Bar... |
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Post by bltherf on Oct 13, 2018 22:46:17 GMT -6
Our first herdbull. 1967   |
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Post by timbernt on Oct 14, 2018 5:55:25 GMT -6
That is an HOP bull I would like to use.
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Post by bltherf on Oct 14, 2018 18:10:02 GMT -6
Still have some semen but it’s in ampules. Your probably one of the few on here who could still know how to use them. His son 4 B was better. Have some amps of him too. Should use it this year , if I could stand to do all the red tape it takes to use old bulls
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Post by rockmillsherefords on Oct 14, 2018 20:39:31 GMT -6
So BLT did ya mess up your herd id back then or it's meant to be that way.
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Post by bltherf on Oct 14, 2018 20:52:31 GMT -6
So BLT did ya mess up your herd id back then or it's meant to be that way. ?? |
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Post by rockmillsherefords on Oct 14, 2018 21:02:17 GMT -6
CXT herd id, it's not XTC link |
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Post by bltherf on Oct 14, 2018 21:15:55 GMT -6
Herd prefix has always been XTC My fathers play on words about the joy of raising Herefords That was pre the drug or band of the same name. Should have patented it then. Would have paid better than ranching! Original tatoo was Cxt because xtc was taken then Was able to get that a few years ago
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Post by timbernt on Oct 14, 2018 21:48:29 GMT -6
Byron, what will you use 22Y or 4B on? I guess we both know there would be interest in a 4B son. Better get it done soon, we are getting old.
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Post by bltherf on Oct 14, 2018 22:06:30 GMT -6
Always look for a bit of maternal line breeding but even 4B is a long way out from today’s pedigrees, even here. Probably some 38J descendants . I have never been a big proponent of using old bulls , but 4B would not worry me. We have made a lot of improvements in the Hereford breed over the years, despite some of the recent fad type trends that never were considered by serious cattlemen who bred good doing cattle to make a living selling pounds
There are a few bloodlines worthy of reaching back for , as long as nostalgia doesn’t trump practical and economic sense Unfortunately our insistence on follow the leader marketing has eliminated some good ones
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Post by timbernt on Oct 15, 2018 20:47:47 GMT -6
Did 4B have as much muscle as the pictures show? I really want to find an old English bred bull with lots of meat. An itch I have been trying to scratch for a long time.
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Post by hoekland on Oct 16, 2018 15:03:41 GMT -6
Did 4B have as much muscle as the pictures show? I really want to find an old English bred bull with lots of meat. An itch I have been trying to scratch for a long time. Let me know when you find one who’s semen qualify for export! |
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Post by bltherf on Oct 16, 2018 18:43:42 GMT -6
Those old bulls were meaty. 22y maybe a bit more but 4b threw better daughters and could still make bulls . No doubt the easiest way to export those genetics wild be to raise a good son and collect him Trying to qualify this old stuff would be very difficult under today’s AI sire approval rules and export qualifications . I would give you some if I could Tim but don’t think that’s possible. Will ask.
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Post by bltherf on Oct 16, 2018 18:51:54 GMT -6
Did 4B have as much muscle as the pictures show? I really want to find an old English bred bull with lots of meat. An itch I have been trying to scratch for a long time This is XTC Standard Lad 15E Born in 1973 and sent down to the Shaw test center in Idaho. Did very well on the gain test and Tom Shaw bought him. Left them some good cows I always thought his dam was one of our very best cows from that era .  |
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Post by timbernt on Oct 16, 2018 19:33:33 GMT -6
It would be neat to trade 9A semen for 4B semen. Kind of like my Dad use to say about my what if ideas: "If the dog hadn't stopped to defecate he would have caught the rabbit!". But one of his words was different.
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Post by woodford on Oct 17, 2018 21:12:16 GMT -6
Byron,
What was 22Y's weight at maturity? I looked at our pedigree for an old herd bull:XTC STANDARD LAD 47H C01710200 and found 22Y as a maternal grandsire. Interestingly 4B comes into our herd through the Jim Hole bull: STANDARD BOY 48H C01665074. Both 47H and 48H were good bulls, with enough frame, but also well covered in muscle.
Woodford
EDIT: 4B also came in through the 9A bull, forgot that.
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Post by bltherf on Oct 19, 2018 6:12:35 GMT -6
Byron, What was 22Y's weight at maturity? I looked at our pedigree for an old herd bull:XTC STANDARD LAD 47H C01710200 and found 22Y as a maternal grandsire. Interestingly 4B comes into our herd through the Jim Hole bull: STANDARD BOY 48H C01665074. Both 47H and 48H were good bulls, with enough frame, but also well covered in muscle. Woodford EDIT: 4B also came in through the 9A bull, forgot that. 22y weighed about 2600 at maturity. Not overly tall but deep and heavy muscled. The 47h you used come from a good maternal line |
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Post by simoon on Oct 19, 2018 6:16:48 GMT -6
Byron, What was 22Y's weight at maturity? I looked at our pedigree for an old herd bull:XTC STANDARD LAD 47H C01710200 and found 22Y as a maternal grandsire. Interestingly 4B comes into our herd through the Jim Hole bull: STANDARD BOY 48H C01665074. Both 47H and 48H were good bulls, with enough frame, but also well covered in muscle. Woodford EDIT: 4B also came in through the 9A bull, forgot that. 22y weighed about 2600 at maturity. Not overly tall but deep and heavy muscled. The 47h you used come from a good maternal line What did this bull’s daughters weigh at maturity? |
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Post by bltherf on Oct 19, 2018 6:27:41 GMT -6
22y weighed about 2600 at maturity. Not overly tall but deep and heavy muscled. The 47h you used come from a good maternal line What did this bull’s daughters weigh at maturity? Usually about 1500 but could run a bit bigger depending on the dams . Mature cow wt is highly influenced by environment and feed as well. I don’t think they would get as big the way we run our cows now . Our northern environment tends to grow cattle bigger than the same genetics further south . |
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Post by rockmillsherefords on Nov 9, 2018 17:42:15 GMT -6
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Post by woodford on Nov 10, 2018 9:32:05 GMT -6
My grandfather used to tell of the Hazlett cattle that George Rodanz had in Ontario, Canada. He said that the cow paths, or cattle trails on the Rodanz farm were usually 2 trails side by side with grass growing in between. Seeing the above picture and the distance between the legs on those cattle reminded me of this.
I have read elsewhere of people that do not like the old fashioned short and wide heads of many of the older Hereford cattle citing that these heads caused a lot of calving difficulty. Seeing this picture, I can not help but wonder if many of the calving difficulties of long ago were not more from the breeding of good quality wide cattle on inferior cows that were simply not built internally for this type of calf? If wide cattle of this type were not the normal type of average, then average cattle may not have been able to handle this phenotype, and is one reason that the wider cattle have since disappeared.
Woodford
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Post by hoekland on Nov 10, 2018 10:32:33 GMT -6
How many calves have you pulled where the sides of the head got hung up on the sides if the pelvic opening? I’ve never had to. I’ve pulled quite a number where the forehead got hung up on the top of the pelvic opening. I had a neighbour at the old farm that milked holsteins that gave me plenty of practice. Those very same holsteins didn’t struggle pushing blockier Hereford cross calves out of my bulls.
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Post by tartancowgirl on Nov 10, 2018 12:42:05 GMT -6
A bit off topic but when did people start weighing calves and recording birthweight? I don’t remember it being much of a thing when I was young?
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Post by George on Nov 10, 2018 15:15:28 GMT -6
A bit off topic but when did people start weighing calves and recording birthweight? I don’t remember it being much of a thing when I was young? I seem to remember it being an option when the TPR program began in the 60s. But we never did it, only weighed at weaning. |
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Post by woodford on Nov 11, 2018 9:39:41 GMT -6
It would be interesting to me to know what the ribeye area was of these cattle. I was once told that some years ago, there was a bull day event in Britain that was basically a display of bulls of all beef breeds, and its intent was for dairymen to come and look in order to help make decisions of which breeds of beef cattle would be the most profitable to breed their dairy cows to. Much of the UK market for breeding bulls in the beef industry comes from the dairy industry, and most of the usual beef breeds were represented at the show, including both the MUSH Hereford and the Traditional Hereford. What made this event interesting was the fact that the Belgian Blue section had a technician present who was demonstrating the ultrasound scanning of the ribeye area of the Belgian Blue bull, or bulls that was/were there that day, intended to show that the double muscled breed was superior in ribeye area to all other beef breeds. Somewhere along the line, they got the idea to ultrasound all, or several of the other cattle present, no doubt to prove that the Belgian Blue was indeed superior in this regard. The end result probably left egg on more than just one face face. Not only did the Belgian Blue lose this impromptu contest, but so did the MUSH, as the winner of the day in having the largest ribeye area was the Traditional Hereford bull that was owned, I am told, by Albany Farms. Interestingly enough, this bull day event has since been discontinued. Woodford |
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