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Post by randy on Jun 16, 2016 21:50:42 GMT -6
Schwisow Herefords at Ritzville WA..... very important herd to the breed.... Who here knows anything about them? Please share... I believe that Schwisow's were the owners of Mark Donald and Donald Dhu....along with Mark Donald 77 and Donald Dhu 10... Someone please correct me if I am wrong... I remember the old timers talking about them.... There were some amazing stories... There were also some amazing stories about Herb Chandler... |
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Post by randy on Jun 16, 2016 21:55:44 GMT -6
Who has something to share about Tom Dashiell or Harold Thompson? Both left a mark on the Hereford breed that stands tall today..
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Post by btlrupert on Jun 16, 2016 22:04:29 GMT -6
Thank goodness Danny Miller saved the RWJ cattle! What about the old Blanchard and Lindgren herd? Does any one have those today?
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Post by erherf on Jun 17, 2016 5:33:26 GMT -6
So what awful things did the Line 1s do to cause this hatred? The short comings of many L1's have caused several I know to leave Herefords. They have some very strong points but as one feeder buyer said they also have some short comings that have held the breed back. Many on here cuss certain bloodlines but many seem afraid to say anything negative about L1's. Glen and some others have some nice L1's. But the majority lack the needed muscling, I have seen some feet issues and have been told about 1-2 that had hernias. They are like any bloodline they aren't perfect and when linebred it is hard to correct the short comings. It can be done and Glen's herd is a testament to that. My name is Richard, does that make me good or bad. Get my point |
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Post by George on Jun 17, 2016 8:08:49 GMT -6
I sure would hate to see a good thread derailed because of L1 bashing...or a polled/horned debate breaking out!
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Post by Glenn on Jun 17, 2016 8:20:09 GMT -6
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Post by mehf on Jun 17, 2016 12:27:03 GMT -6
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Post by randy on Jun 17, 2016 13:08:40 GMT -6
Who can tell stories about... James Grote of Granite Hills... Jim Bob Steen... Jake Hess.... Colby-Jim Conkwright..
Who were the owners of the Willa-ray hereford Farms at Winterset Iowa?
Who heard of MV Ranches at Bridge Idaho the in turn became Curtis-Simplot? Denny Curtis and Scott Simplot...Denny's son Rod Purchased Rudy and Jedd Van Kampens place at Logan, UT
Helmer and son Brent Horn... Brent had the Horn's Breeding Cattle Center at Hermiston OR... he spent a big wad of $$ on females... Did he buy Lerch or an interest in Denver... I was there and cannot remember how that all shook out..
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Post by randy on Jun 17, 2016 13:22:06 GMT -6
I would love to hear stories about the old timers in the LeForce families.... Ben, Henry etc... Was Jack a brother or a cousin? My parents came from that area of Oklahoma and mom talked about them some... They were fence to fence with one of my uncles places in the Sand Hills... guffeygal?  Who knows about Dr James Carr that was the original owner of Selkirk Herefords when they started at Sandpoint, ID? John McDonald? Jitters Childress? Lucky Hereford Ranch? Gilroy CA.... the guy owned Lucky Lager Beer..... What was the hereford farm that owned HOP N Gator Beer? one of our jr board member went to a field day there... remember him telling about it... |
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Post by randy on Jun 17, 2016 13:46:16 GMT -6
Although no one has mentioned them in this forum I believe... Babbitt Ranches in AZ may be the most prolific Hereford breeding operation there is today.. The Hashknife Branded Cattle and Horses are something that needs to be looked at from many views...
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Post by Sudsy on Jun 17, 2016 14:33:39 GMT -6
Am also interested in hearing of Babbit ranches.
Are/were they the largest Hereford herd in north America?
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Post by Glenn on Jun 17, 2016 14:56:22 GMT -6
I'd like to hear about the history and people behind the Lund Herd of cattle.
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Post by erherf on Jun 17, 2016 20:04:57 GMT -6
Cloverdale is Tom and Judy Cheetham from red stone. Still ranching but all red angus and biggest hereford hater because of line ones. Dave Witt was iou ranch. Passed away couple years back. He had big outfit at sand springs. Lost one son in Iraq and I think another son still running it. No herefords still lots of bad tastes from the line ones also So what awful things did the Line 1s do to cause this hatred? Sorry to have gotten things off track but this post kinda struck a nerve. The history behind a lot of these herds is quite interesting and the reason for them leaving Herefords are quite varied, but to blame it onto a bloodline seems rather absurd. Ive used certain bulls that have proven not to live up to there expectations but that my fault for making that selection not the whole bloodline. The two herds mentioned here were herds that I thought had attractive cattle in there ads, but because of the struggles of keeping things going in the early 80s I never got to check them out. |
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Post by guffeygal on Jun 17, 2016 20:29:07 GMT -6
Jack LeForce is a cousin to the LeForces of LeForce Herefords. He ( Jack) was from Garber originally. He still lives in Edmond and has a ranch south of Perry that he still operates. I think he is 88 and his health is pretty good. Jack was assistant manager at Lucky Hereford Ranch and was instrumental in developing their performance program. Jack was able to obtain some of the best cattle from Lucky's when he moved to 26 Bar. They were of Donald Dhu and Stanway Lad breeding and did an excellent job at 26 Bar.
The LeForce Family of LeForce Herefords made the run when The Cherokee Outlet was opened up in 1893. Henry Jefferson and his mother both homesteaded a quarter and they built a house on the 1/4 line meeting the requirements for both quarters. I never did know Ceph although I may have met him when I was a kid. I think he did a lot towards building the operation. Got to know his wife Forrest a little . She passed away the first year we worked there. She was a very nice lady. She told The Baptist Minister in Pond Creek that he needed to wrap up his sermons a little quicker as he was making her late to watch The Dallas Cowboys Games.
We went to work for Henry S. when they split the operation into 3 divisions in 1983. He had most of the rangeland and all the registered cows around 300 cows. He was a very astute businessman and was very good to us. They had an excellent ranch with lots of grass. One of his goals was to have a Production Sale. Unfortunately his health went downhill and he died 8 months before our first sale. We were able to host The Oklahoma Jr. Hereford Association Field Day in 1989 while he was still feeling pretty good. I think he got quite a bit of pleasure out of doing that.
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Post by randy on Jun 17, 2016 21:07:51 GMT -6
Am also interested in hearing of Babbit ranches. Are/were they the largest Hereford herd in north America? They run around 8000 straight Hereford cows.... I do not know of any operation with more Hereford cows... i have seen lots of their calves a few times. I was impressed to say the least. There are some sizeable hereford operations in this part of the country. Nothing even close to Babbits.. |
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Post by randy on Jun 17, 2016 21:36:20 GMT -6
I'd like to hear about the history and people behind the Lund Herd of cattle. I do not know much about Stan Lund and family... met him one time when we bought some females. What I do know is two things. #1 Just before dusk those females would have their calf gathered up and be hold up in a good place for the night. #2 LHR L1 Domino 337 (Goliath) was my least favorite and not typical of the Lund cattle.. He had that white white hair that threw a big red flag up for me. ( The white white hair was not typical of the Lund cattle). He was a bull that had you painted him up like a Holstein. Most people would not have been able to tell the difference. The set of Lund cows that Carlson's had were outstanding.. They would also have their calves gathered about Dusk.. |
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Post by strojanherefords on Jun 17, 2016 23:20:00 GMT -6
Am also interested in hearing of Babbit ranches. Are/were they the largest Hereford herd in north America? Isn't the former secretary of the interior Bruce Babbitt a member of that family? |
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Post by timbernt on Jun 18, 2016 6:19:34 GMT -6
You guys from Arizona may correct me, but my understanding is that while Bruce came from that family he was such a left-wing nut that they didn't feel he represented them very well. I have heard the cowboys that watched him grow up considered him pretty much a joke and that much of his anti-ranching efforts as secretary of the interior stemmed from that. At any rate, he was quite opposed to our way of life.
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Post by guffeygal on Jun 18, 2016 7:31:28 GMT -6
Last I remember one of The Indian Nations owned 26 Bar's Springerville place. Was it The Hopi's or am I mixed up?
As a history note for you younger breeders, the same headquarters was home to Milky Way Herefords.
Quite a bit of that ranch was forest permit and State owned land. I don't think there was a whole lot of deeded land.
The leases and permits sold about like real estate I think.
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Post by randy on Jun 18, 2016 10:15:58 GMT -6
Last I remember one of The Indian Nations owned 26 Bar's Springerville place. Was it The Hopi's or am I mixed up? As a history note for you younger breeders, the same headquarters was home to Milky Way Herefords. Quite a bit of that ranch was forest permit and State owned land. I don't think there was a whole lot of deeded land. The leases and permits sold about like real estate I think. I believe you are correct about the Hopi lease. Yes and the leases and permits sold just as real estate would. (That is an entire story in itself today. Reason for the war on the range out west) When I was at 26 Bar the first time the big white barn was a story in itself. They had repainted it and had 26 Bar lettered on it.... The Milky Way lettering in Black was bleeding through the white paint in a haze. I am sure that was frustration to the people painting. John Wayne and Louis Johnson were known as the owners. There was also another owner who owned an interest. I cannot remember his name but he owned Knott's Berry Farm in CA.... |
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Post by moon on Jun 18, 2016 14:23:14 GMT -6
Who can tell stories about... James Grote of Granite Hills... Jim Bob Steen... Jake Hess.... Colby-Jim Conkwright.. Who were the owners of the Willa-ray hereford Farms at Winterset Iowa? Who heard of MV Ranches at Bridge Idaho the in turn became Curtis-Simplot? Denny Curtis and Scott Simplot...Denny's son Rod Purchased Rudy and Jedd Van Kampens place at Logan, UT Helmer and son Brent Horn... Brent had the Horn's Breeding Cattle Center at Hermiston OR... he spent a big wad of $$ on females... Did he buy Lerch or an interest in Denver... I was there and cannot remember how that all shook out.. Regarding Lerch, Mike Armitage of Claremore,OK, told me himself several years ago that when Stryker Herefords sold to either a Doctor or Dentist named Chuck Miller from Ohio in either late 1977 or in 1978 he was hired to manage the operation and was also to be a partner to some extent with the cattle only. He immediately told the new owner that to make an immediate impact with the herd that he (Mike) should go to Denver and buy the best bull in Mike's opinion available. Mike went, chose Lerch, who was Reserve Champion in 1978 an Senior Champion in 1979, and bought him in the name of Brushcreek Herefords for $100,000.00, sole and complete ownership topping the sale. The frame race was ramping up and they bred him to every cow they could. That Fall they offered females either bred, exposed, or semen with purchase in their production sale. I think the new owner had previously paid $60,000.00 plus for a bull at Cooper's in March 1978 for CL1 Domino 775 by 350, and also the same year bought HH Advance A718. The owner had financial issues and a complete dispersion was held in December 1980. Lerch was purchased by Wyoming Hereford Ranch, I skipped school and was there, bringing $261,000.00. A718 brought $25,000.00 to Joe Dauber, and 775 had trouble getting a bid and was marked off to the Sale manager at a fabricated price below $10,000.00. Denver 1981 sees Lerch's son, David, top the sale at $310,000.00. As sometimes true to form, Mike had to sue Miller to get money rightfully due him under the arrangement he had with Miller. Not aware of Horn buying an interest prior the dispersal, but yes he paid mega bucks for the time for females, and as I recall used 7777 extensively and did a lot of ET work. Rex Seibert told me and may have put it in print, that Colby Conkwright, the father if I am right, was a true cowman with an exceptional eye for breeding Hereford cattle. His son, if I do not have them mixed up, on the other hand not even close and he bought cattle almost everywhere even going back East to Still House Hollow when it dispersed. Both Brushcreek and Still House Hollow are typical examples of Hereford operations in the late 70's and early 80's buying one or more Line One bulls, breeding them for one or two calf crops then dispersing their herds. Codding Cattle Ranch aka Research in OK did not even wait to get a calf crop with HH Advance C008, and after the summer breeding season of 1975 sold out in September of that year with that bull topping the sale for I think $7,750.00 or thereabouts to 4L and another Tenn. farm. I was at that sale, and C008 was unstable on his front feet due to a botched hoof trimming job. I think he fully recovered. I think Lund sold out in 1976, and of major interest was 7520 by former Miles City sire 69145. McLean got him, then he dispersed in May 1977. 7520 referred to as " the Lund Bull " and was marked off at $21,000.00, without any calves on the ground. The Berry's in Wyoming ended up with part of that bull. The most interesting bull I saw at McLean's dispersion was J215, and he only brought $6,300.00 for half interest which was probably the best investment of the day. Heard a few stories about issues when Hess was on the AHA board. With respect to the Babbitt Ranch, the Journal/World did an extensive article on it since 1998 or 2000. Yes, even though Bruce B. was related, I think the article emphasized he had no ownership interest in the Ranch at that time. I seemed to recall the article featured a picture of a rare Jaguar that roamed the ranch. In addition to Mike, Cliff Copeland worked at 26 Bar. Correct me if I run afoul of history, but did not a breeder from California with last name Thurber initially partner with Wayne and Johnson at the time they bought the Lucky Hereford Ranch cows, then later Wayne and Johnson bought him out? If you want the verified version on 26 Bar, get the book from Johnson's widow titled " John Wayne....there rode a legend ". She advertised in Hereford America a few years ago. I bought a case and gave them to members of the PTP, family, and judges. John Wayne died intestate, ie. without a will, causing a probate nightmare. 60 Minutes did an extensive story on it. The outfit then sold to Karl Eller and a group of investors, I think their corporate endeavors was centered around 7-11 conv. stores. Mike would know best. Eller and his group sold out in 1986, and for more history the main part of the catalog was published in the May issue I believe. Tom Chauncey then leased the place from one of the Tribes, and Marshall Hartman's son, Dave, managed it. One year when Tom could not make it to Denver, I saw Dave set up a video camera with tripod in the main arena and film the entire Denver hill show, might have done the yard as well. Chauncey in the 60's has partnered with Wayne Newton and Gene Autry on a Hereford operation. |
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Post by guffeygal on Jun 18, 2016 15:09:48 GMT -6
I think the 3rd 26 Bar partner originally was Ken Reifschnider (may be spelled wrong).Don't think he stayed with it too long. The big rock sign on the mountain side as you came into the place was changed from MW Herefords to 26 (with a bar under it) Herefords. You could see the MW outline for years in that dry mountain side. Jack LeForce had worked there when it was Milky Way soon after his Korean War Service.
Really don't know much about 26 Bar after Mr. Wayne's death. We left about Christmas 78 before his death. Do remember Karl Eller name and Tom Chauncey had bought some cattle at Winrock's in the 60's.
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Post by moon on Jun 18, 2016 15:18:31 GMT -6
For more history get Orville Beyea's " Against the Current ". Was at his dispersion and visited his place at least twice prior. I have high regard for Mr. Beyea, and he and his late wife were always very gracious to me. Lynn Loosli is deceased. I have always held Lynn in high regard and both greatly admired and respected him. Not only for his many accomplishments, but he was a true gentleman and was respectful to everyone. His herdsman of many years Verl Dial had nothing but great things to say about Lynn Loosli. At his dispersion in 1992 and attended several production sales. Prior to the dispersion he and his son, Brian, bought a large group of Red Anus cows. Brian been running operation for years since. At Midland in late 90's they had top selling Red Angus bull at Midland and top average. Loosli's at one time and for several years had one of the largest seed potato operations in North America, may still do. MJB went South Devon a number of years ago, and has been at Midland for years. John McKnight sold most of his Herefords in the 80's and went Brangus, serving on their board. The last time he judged the Hereford show at Kansas City, after he had been away from Herefords for many years, AHA staff members and breeders in attendance told me he really did a number on the good cattle by placing almost every thing Lone Star had in first, and both Grand and Reserve bulls were from Lone Star. One other Texas breeder went so far as to take glue and fashion a Lone Star brand on one his animals in attempt to expose his bias. Frank Sparks' ranch has been continuously in operation, now being operated by his son, Tom, and his grandsons. They have a sale every year in December I believe. Made prior arrangements to visit last August but could not make cell phone connection once stopped in Plevna, just could not make contact at the time so went on down road. Tom has been a voting delegate to the AHA meeting for the past several years. They have a lot of demand for their cattle in that area, and last time I spoke to grandson, Frank, they were getting a lot of interest from Canada. Their bloodlines are a mixture of Tarringtons, Line Ones, and Tiberius. Chris Jacobsen's cattle were very popular back in 60's and 70's, and several came to Arkansas when I was a kid. After Chris died the herd dispersed, but his son and widow kept a few, then went Saler. I think the son and his kids still operate but added Angus in the mix. |
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Post by bookcliff on Jun 18, 2016 19:18:44 GMT -6
Although no one has mentioned them in this forum I believe... Babbitt Ranches in AZ may be the most prolific Hereford breeding operation there is today.. The Hashknife Branded Cattle and Horses are something that needs to be looked at from many views... between the CO-Bar and Hashknife, your right. back when Lovell was still with the assn and he was helping me with the Manhattan Hereford Feeder Calf sales, he went down to Babbitts one fall when the weighed shipped all those thousands of straight hereford yrling steers to a buyer in Nebraska that was wanting to put em thru CHB when they were finished. was down there for like 4 or 5 days. anyway he told me as impressive as those steers were, and they were pretty impressive, the remuda was even better. Oh, and as far as I'm concerned Lovell was a damn good man and we could only wish all our staff eventually reach his level of understanding both the seedstock and commercial side of things. |
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Post by btlrupert on Jun 18, 2016 19:19:15 GMT -6
Did anyone see the question I posted on the old Blanchard and Lindgren cattle? Does anyone have those as a pure strain. I remember the old Thyra cow family being very strong in that herd.
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