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Post by Glenn on Feb 16, 2021 14:32:39 GMT -6
I got an email from a producer considering Hereford Bulls. He'd like some thoughts/ideas/feedback. Keep it above the waist!
>>>I’m in a position where I’m starting up a new herd, I bought bred black angus heifers. Now I need to buy bulls and in a discussion with my sale barn owner, he suggested I get some Hereford bulls as he thought I could do well selling the calves. Fine, I’m up for something new.
In my research on your forum I see some here think this MD thing is a big deal, and I see the reasoning and concern involved. I see the linages involved and as I’m researching bulls I see these names popping up all over the place, especially in the bulls I like the looks of. Go figure. So my question is how much of an issue is this MD thing going to be for a cow/calf guy like me? My intent is to sell quality f1 black baldy calves. I’m probably worrying too much but when that SOB Murphy rides your back like he does mine I try to have everything researched through and through.
Next, just a general recommendation for bulls and upcoming sales I should look at for my moderate frame heifers? Thanks.<<<
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Post by lcc on Feb 17, 2021 8:51:18 GMT -6
Oof. In my opinion it shouldn't even be a question. If you are selling breeding stock, I think you have a responsibility to avoid all genetic defects, not just MD.
I understand he might like genetics associated with MD. Truth be told, I've got a 10Y son that I'm waiting for results back on now. If he's negative, I'll probably use him. If he's positive, he'll probably go to the sale barn.
Regardless, this man should be able to find bulls with those genetics that are MDF.
Honestly, based on what I see here and on FB, he should just buy some of your bulls and not worry about MD!
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Post by Glenn on Feb 17, 2021 14:27:11 GMT -6
He’s in Northern Nebraska. I got the feeling from reading the email he was interested in Polled but that’s an assumption and may not be true. He sent the email to HT, not to me personally.
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Post by strojanherefords on Feb 17, 2021 17:02:02 GMT -6
The fact that a breeder is willing to sell an animal that is possibly a genetic carrier is a bigger issue than the genetic defect itself. If the guy wants to buy a Hereford bull to breed to Angus cows to make terminal baldy calves, he is never going to have to deal with a recessive genetic defect. But seeing a potential genetic defect in a sale catalog is a sign that the breeder is paying attention to other issues that could bite their customers in the rear. My best advice is to buy bulls from people who use their own bulls. Folks who use their own bulls know what they are selling and what animals would work for you.
As far as females, I am a little concerned that you bought heifers because they need extra help compared to older cows. For best results, heifers need extra help until they are pregnant with their second calf.
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Post by Glenn on Feb 17, 2021 18:28:14 GMT -6
Paul, the problem with that is that even if he sells everything as weaned calves or yearlings, someone could buy the heifers at the stockyards with the intent to breed them. The only way to guarantee that it never becomes an issue is to steer all the bull calves AND spay ALL the heifer calves. He, PERSONALLY, wouldn’t have an issue but the recessive gene is now loose in the general commercial cattle population.
In my opinion, and I know I don’t get to make the rules, there is NO reason to sell carrier bulls.
Even worse is NOT TESTING and “playing dumb” and selling the carriers.
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Post by strojanherefords on Feb 17, 2021 18:48:56 GMT -6
I agree. The point I was trying to make is that a breeder who sells carriers is also not culling for other issues that would be a problem for their buyers and the breed at large.
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Post by rockmillsherefords on Feb 17, 2021 20:18:05 GMT -6
Well I hope his Angus heifers were from a breeder that test for genetic abnormalities, they have 12 listed on the AAA site, it shouldn't be any different looking for a Hereford bull, buy from someone who tests. Pretty simple.
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Post by Glenn on Feb 17, 2021 20:52:35 GMT -6
Paul (popular name on this thread), I agree, as bad as the Herefords are getting with the defects the Angus folks have more and they also seem to have the same issues with people selling carriers both knowingly and unknowingly.
I think George’s tagline quote of Larry Leonhart definitely applies in spades and across breeds these days.
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redgem
Weanling
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Post by redgem on Feb 17, 2021 21:17:03 GMT -6
Personally I'm not that concerned about the MD or any other issues, it's more about buying from a trusted breeder and animals that are tested if parents are not clean. Defects will always be around, but there's ways to manage or test for them, we just need to do what works for your program.
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Post by rockmillsherefords on Feb 17, 2021 21:39:00 GMT -6
Paul (popular name on this thread), I agree, as bad as the Herefords are getting with the defects the Angus folks have more and they also seem to have the same issues with people selling carriers both knowingly and unknowingly. I think George’s tagline quote of Larry Leonhart definitely applies in spades and across breeds these days. Wonder when Leonhart said that, 20 years ago? It's definitely a con game, associations are guilty too. |
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Post by soherf on Apr 3, 2021 19:37:46 GMT -6
I just finished the book "The Battle of the Bull Runts" and breeders unleashed dwarfs onto commercial herds back in the 1950's so what makes MD any different?
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