Interesting article in the HW about the Trask cattle

[Glenn]

I think one of our new members is working on this project.

I love these articles so much more than this show or that show or show this, show that.....

[postoak1]

When is the article coming out?

[mrvictordomino]

Aug 29, 2014 5:26:29 GMT -6 postoak1 said:

When is the article coming out?

It's in the September issue of the Hereford World.

[postoak1]

Mine hasn't came yet.

[Deleted]

Maybe it's just me but that picture of fowler reminds me of jack cooper.

[elkwc]

Neither has mine. But with the changes in how the postal service processes mail mine has to go half way around the US before it gets to me. Maybe in another week I'll have mine.

[postoak1]

I love the part of the article where it refers to Trask/Fowler cattle as "ingredient cattle".

[Glenn]

Shouldn't all cattle be ingredient cattle? I think that is where we go wrong. Trying to breed for everything in one package.

[larso]

I haven't seen the article you are guys are referring to, but your comment Glenn 'Trying to breed for everything in one package' is something I have wondered for a long time. Do we accept the fact that a Hereford steer will never out perform a Euro x steer in the chiller room.
Listened to a talk 12mths ago from a consultant who had bench marked 100's of commercial beef produces, the top 5% were all crossbreeding. They were using Hereford bulls over the cows and Angus bulls over the heifers, that way they maintained the level of hybrid vigour they were looking for. Sure the Hereford was playing a very important part in their program but it wasn't providing everything.

[Glenn]

Probably cause a firestorm, but I believe we as Hereford breeders need to breed to be a "piece". It's up the the individual to determine where they want to be. I personally breed my cattle to be a "maternal piece".

I do not think we will ever out grade a Limousin or out marble a Wagyu or outgain a Charolais in the feedlot. Most commercial folks know this. In fact they have been sold "one breed can do it all" by Angus folks and the realization is setting in that it isn't true. That I believe is the reason we are seeing a resurgence now in Hereford popularity.

My belief is that we will be a big piece of the maternal factory. F-1 Hereford Angus cows that a commercial guy breeds to Wagyu for a first calf then breeds the rest of her life to a Charolais. Ect....

[larso]

I agree, it's not to say we don't need to improve certain traits (what ever that might be), but for the commercial man that 10/15% advantage with hybrid vigour is free and I for one if I was just breeding commercially would take full advantage.

[Glenn]

Right. I am not saying to not always be trying to improve and move forward. I think (hope) we all do that.

[btlrupert]

I'll share some background and our challenges... Through the generosity of Randy Owen we flushed 10 Trask cows 7 years ago.  Also Teddy Gentry and Dave roberts were very helpful in semen acquisition. As you know the herd was spread everywhere across the US.  We have gone thru several stages of culling and eliminated many animals.  Some of the original cows offspring did not work as some of the original donors had a common outcross bull that just did not "nick". Bad feet,udders and hair problems at 4 years of age.  36 females went directly to the slaughter house. That set us way back on numbers but had to be done.  We are concentrating on progeny of Nt Excel Plato, Nt Plato Rupert 167 and Nt Rupert E132.. . The challenge is we have now a very narrow gene pool. Not the 300 plus females that were at Trask Ranch which wre linebred but had out crosses made over the 60 plus years..  The cool thing is that Mossy Plato 26 was owned by our University.  Mr. Starky, Clemson professor, purchased the bull in 1934 and 7 heifers from Leslie Brannon of Kansas.  You will recognize  the 26th as the fountain head of the Plato and Victor Domino cattle as well as the King Dominos ( I think)... Our big challenge is to keep the type and kind of the cows we have but to also correct some faults.  All of this is being done within lines of Mossy Plato 26.  The thing I cherish most in the cattle world is not my degrees but the many times I spent with Mr. trask at the ranch.  Learned so much!!  Also I will point out that Mr. Trask used blood of the President Mischiefs and blended with heavy Hazlett influence cattle ... Hope this gives everyone a little background ... I turned the herd over to Dr. Bolt a few years back but still serve as advisor... 

[Carlos (frmaiz)]

In recent years progeny of BTF 6104 8350 (Alabama) has been very popular in Argentina. His dam is linebred to NT Plato 35. So far 2133 registered animals and some more through several sons.
For my taste progeny is somewhat small and lacks growth but conformation is very good. Here is a picture of an Alabama son that I owned.

[btlrupert]

Agree with conformation comment and they (straight Trask) do lack growth.  The NT victor 35 cattle were good. We have 3 first calf heifers by the sire of your Alabama bull out of trask cows. They are the best first calf heifers, more maternal than straight NT females...   Early trask cattle (1960's thru 1970's) were more maternal and had a little more growth than the ones we know today.   I grew up with 1200 to 1350 lb trask cows and 1800lb to ton bulls.  We typically weaned 500 to 575 lb thick calves.  Frames were probably 4 to 5's... 

[Carlos (frmaiz)]

Here is Alabama
link

[btlrupert]

The 6104 bull was out of a very nice balanced cow. The breeder on the dam was Mr. Frank Chastain here in South Carolina. 

[cflory]

I am sampling some of the Trask line myself. They have surprised me in some ways and let me down in others. First I thought they would be the answer to fescue, not bad but not the magic bullet. The cows are still ruff haired but the yearling bull below has impressed me with how fast he slicked off and has maintained and gained weight better than any other yearling we have owned on fescue while breeding cows. Eye set, to far forward and the first ones to get pinkeye. The growth rate has been interesting, they grow well as a calf and continue up until about ten months then stall while other lines blow past them. We have only fed them through one winter but the cold may have something to do with it as that is when they shut off last year. I will breed the first outcross trask heifers this fall so I will have to see if they are going to fit the program the way I hope but they look the part so far. I knew going in I would have to watch the frame size and performance but do think they could be an" ingredient" to improve cattle if needed in certain areas.

[btlrupert]

Folks need to know that Mr. Trask had a lot of Dallis grass. Had fescue as well but lots of clover too. Cattle ran on both but lots of Dallis in the summer.  Like your bull. Did you breed him?

[cflory]

Good to know about the grass. I bought his mother bred and this is what I got. FPH Plato 908 if you would like to look him up, I would like to hear what you think of his genetics. We sampled him on a couple of reg. cows and a dozen black cows. I did feed out a 3/4 brother and was impressed with his 69% hanging weight. I bought 8 bred heifers from Ozark Hills Genetics two years ago.

[btlrupert]

Looked him up. Very good pedigree! Your bull has some very good breeding with Trask and GDQ. Always a positive for me when I see breeding from Mr. George Queener. He was a very good cattlemen. Any Trask bred bulls with semen available we are interested. Anyone reading , please let us know.

[jayh]

Sept 1, 2014 19:08:28 GMT -6 cflory said:

I am sampling some of the Trask line myself. They have surprised me in some ways and let me down in others. First I thought they would be the answer to fescue, not bad but not the magic bullet. The cows are still ruff haired but the yearling bull below has impressed me with how fast he slicked off and has maintained and gained weight better than any other yearling we have owned on fescue while breeding cows. Eye set, to far forward and the first ones to get pinkeye. The growth rate has been interesting, they grow well as a calf and continue up until about ten months then stall while other lines blow past them. We have only fed them through one winter but the cold may have something to do with it as that is when they shut off last year. I will breed the first outcross trask heifers this fall so I will have to see if they are going to fit the program the way I hope but they look the part so far. I knew going in I would have to watch the frame size and performance but do think they could be an" ingredient" to improve cattle if needed in certain areas. View Attachment

some members have no idea how rough fescue is on cows.

[btlrupert]

Amen brother! It's rough on cows...

[Carlos (frmaiz)]

Sept 1, 2014 18:27:40 GMT -6 btlrupert said:

We have 3 first calf heifers by the sire of your Alabama bull out of trask cows. They are the best first calf heifers, more maternal than straight NT females...   ... 

Met somebody yesterday that has some semen and it's using it, of BTF 252 6104

[cloverdale1836]

I am looking for some BTF 252 semen.Any help?